MTB 653 |
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AdnamsGirl
Newbie Joined: 20 February 2007 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 12 |
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Posted: 20 February 2007 at 7:22pm |
Hi I'm hoping that someone may be able to help me out with a bit of a mystery regarding MTB 653. I run an archive website dedicated to preserving images and personal memories of The Norfolk Broads. Amongst some pictures sent to me recently were two of a an ex Admiralty boat which has been identified as being MTB 653 dating from 1951. There were sevral old MTBs and MGBs which were converted for use as houseboats on the Broads after the war, of the pictures I have seen of the named ones nothing corresponds with these pictures so she is a bit of a mystery. The main mystery concerns the fact that the first picture puts her on the Northern rivers of the Broads ..... this is a very large vessel to have possibly been up there as there a several low bridges to negotiate! All referrences there are to these converted vessels were on the Southern Broads. The second picture was taken in the same year moored in Norwich but has obviously not been converted ... are these in fact the same boat? The info I have so far has come from fellow members of the Norfolk Broads Forum but I now seem to have drawn a bit of a blank. The suggestion was put forward that it was a boat called Morning Flight which belonged to a boatyard owner - which is how I found this forum through doing a Google search which turned up the fact that Morning Flight was in fact MGB 56. I have found a little bit of the history of MTB 653 through Google which has told me that she sailed under both British and Norwegian flags during WW2 but I cannot find out anything about her history after the war. I know that a number of the Broads boatyards built vessels for the admiralty duing WW2 - was MTB 653 one of those and she returned home? Will try and post the two photos I have below - hope that someone may be able to shed some light for me. Carol |
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AdnamsGirl
Newbie Joined: 20 February 2007 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 12 |
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Hi Picture number 2 which was also from 1951 and at Norwich: |
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S R Wilson
Senior Member Joined: 08 December 2006 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 170 |
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Hi Carol, The boat in your pictures is undoubtedly a Dog boat. Fairmile D. There are none of these boats surviving in this country and it is thought there are none left at all. Other contributers to the forum have more information at their fingertips than I but from memory she was about 117 feet long was powered by 4 v12 Packard engines of about 1200 horse power each which gave a top speed of about 25 knots. Displacement was about 60 tons and as can be seen from your photos in addition to torpedoes she was also heavily armed with various caliber guns. The dog boat was the first British boat designed as a joint MGB and MTB . There will be other posts, if they contradict with mine then they are more likely correct! Regards |
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SRW
"Never yield to force; never yield to the apparently overwhelming might of the enemy" WSC. |
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johnk
Senior Member Joined: 25 March 2006 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1355 |
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Hi Carol and Sentley,
Indeed, what great pictures Ds indeed, (sorry) but as Sentley said, none are believed to survive now so great to see pictures of them. Apart from being a bit of a D nut so to speak, can't offer anymore info but I do hope through this forum you get more on them. Many thanks for posting, all the best,
Regards
John |
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S R Wilson
Senior Member Joined: 08 December 2006 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 170 |
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Hi Carol and John, I think that the 2 photos are indeed the same boat but only on the basis that it would be surprising if there were 2 Ds in such close proximity. MGB 56 is an entirely separate craft being much shorter lighter and faster than the Dog boat. Regards |
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SRW
"Never yield to force; never yield to the apparently overwhelming might of the enemy" WSC. |
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AdnamsGirl
Newbie Joined: 20 February 2007 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 12 |
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Hi Many thanks for the responses so far. That is a real shame to know that none of this particular class exist anymore. As I said, I had found a little information about her wartime history by doing a google search - I found a couple of references to her during 1944. On Feb 13th she was part of a convoy of three British ships which sunk a couple of Norwegian cargo/passeneger ships by mistake - at this time she was flying a Norwegian flag and had a Norwegian crew. On August 19th 1944 she was again part of a convoy of three British ships which sunk the German torpedo boat S-57 off of the Croatian coast. We recently lost one of the classic Broads converted ex Admiralty boats "The Golden Galleon" which was an Fairmile B (ML 162) which had seen many years of service carrying passengers for day trips along the River Yare from Gt Yarmouth. She had been lying at Reedham, very sadly neglected for many years. Despie numerous efforts to save her, she was deemed a hazzard and beyond salvage and was sadly towed away and broken up at the end of last year. MTB 653 certainly remained on the Broads until at least the early 1970s - the picture below was one which I found on a search and I believe dates from around 1972. She was, again, moored at Norwich at the time and was beginning to show some signs of neglect. Thanks again - Carol |
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northeastuser
Senior Member Joined: 10 June 2006 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 446 |
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Is there any information available as to her eventual fate? Perhaps its too much to hope that her remains lie somewhere quiet and undisturbed? If so I bags first look!!!! Where abouts was that picture took? |
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AdnamsGirl
Newbie Joined: 20 February 2007 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 12 |
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Hi Unfortunately there is absolutely no information about what happened to her or anything about her history whilst she was on the Norfolk Broads so far. She is a complete mystery which is very strange given she was obviously there for at least 20 years! As I said, I am a member of a forum dedicated to the Norfolk Broads which has many members who have lived and worked in the area for many, many years but no one seems to remember her. As part of my research into the history of boating on the Broads I have gone through countless old Blakes and Hoseasons boating brochures and there were several ex Admiralty boats which were converted and hired out to holiday makers after the war and, indeed, up until the 1960s and possibly 1970s - this particular vessel does not appear to be listed amongst them though so far as I can tell. You can read the information that we have uncovered so far, and possible suggestions put forward here if any of it will help: http://the-norfolk-broads.co.uk/viewmessages.cfm?Forum=22&am p;Topic=7692 Carol
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Christian
Senior Member Joined: 17 June 2005 Location: Gibraltar Status: Offline Points: 775 |
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Hi Carol A couple more pictures for you, also from the internet; MTB 653 in 1971;
Your picture No 2 is not the same boat, suggest more likely MTB 740;
This picture of another sister-ship during wartime gives a good idea of the heavy armament and how it made them sit much lower in the water;
Rgds, Christian. Edited by Christian |
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clive
Senior Member Joined: 11 December 2006 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 379 |
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Hi Carol, Great pictures, I can't see how the 'D' could ever be on the northern rivers as the bridges at yarmouth are lower than Acle, and that is 13' max.(unless she was sunk through) I have read the threads on the norfolk-broads-forum and if she was in Horning she would be be 'pointing' towards horning next to one of the windpumps which has been rebuilt. I will show the fairmile pictures to my dad tomorrow, he left oulton broad in 1958 and remembers almost everything which went on around the rivers from between the war and then. It is good to see such a large warboat in Horning, It is reassureing to see that one can fit, rumor has it there may be another soon... as for the replies on 'the other' forum they are correct re '56 and Ron Ashby and the very low rail bridges. ps. welcome aboard! |
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masbie something in the water. www.freewebs.com/masb32/
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