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MTB 74

Printed From: BMPT Forum
Category: General Discussion
Forum Name: Modelling
Forum Description: Discussion about Modelling
URL: http://www.bmpt.co.uk/forum_posts.asp?TID=235
Printed Date: 26 May 2019 at 8:45am


Topic: MTB 74
Posted By: Pioneer
Subject: MTB 74
Date Posted: 09 November 2006 at 9:42pm

Dave Abbott allowed me to take these quick snaps of his latest superb scratch built model of the famous Vosper MTB 74 of St Nazaire fame.

This model really has to be seen to appreciate the amount of detail he has managed to put in (and he tells me it isn't finished yet!) while these snaps really do not do it justice.



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Pioneer - Forum Moderator



Replies:
Posted By: Julie
Date Posted: 11 November 2006 at 10:14am

Can anybody tell me what was so special about MTB 74 apart from the peculiar position of the Torpedo Tubes?

Cheers

Julie



Posted By: K225
Date Posted: 12 November 2006 at 2:50am

What's so great about MTB74 check out the following:

http://www.historynet.com/magazines/world_war_2/3031626.html - http://www.historynet.com/magazines/world_war_2/3031626.html



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She'd roll on wet grass!


Posted By: Julie
Date Posted: 12 November 2006 at 11:09am

St Nazair - some party!!

Very brave man - what happened to him - was he killed?

Cheers



Posted By: hslmouldings
Date Posted: 12 November 2006 at 6:07pm
Hi,

What can you say about this model, Fantastic mate!

Was it all scratch built or was it built on a grp hull and what are the fittings scratch or resin cast?

regards

Christopher


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Christopher


Posted By: Pioneer
Date Posted: 12 November 2006 at 9:34pm

 Hello 'Julie',

St Nazaire a 'party'? -I think not! Sub Lt 'Micky' Wynne was blown across the Bridge when MTB 74 received the direct hit and rendered unconscious, (losing his left eye in the process) - there were very few survivors from that overloaded boat but he was saved by Chief Motor Mech Lovegrove who managed to get him onto a Carley Float - both being eventually rescued by the German forces to spend the rest of the War as POW's- Sub Lt 'Micky' Wynne being incarcerated in the infamous Colditz Castle. As you rightly say VERY brave.



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Pioneer - Forum Moderator


Posted By: Pioneer
Date Posted: 17 November 2006 at 9:23am

Another couple of shots of the superb MTB 74 by Dave Abbott

Again- although these shots were taken in a studio - this model must be seen to be appreciated - hopefully will be seen around UK shows.



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Pioneer - Forum Moderator


Posted By: Roger P
Date Posted: 30 November 2006 at 9:53pm

Greetings from OZ,

Here is my short story on Op Chariot:

Op Chariot, 28 Mar 1942.

             The ‘Chariot’ force consisted of, apart from HMS Campbeltown, 18 ‘little ships’ – 16  MLs, a modified MTB and MGB 314 as the HQ ship. Twelve of the MLs carried commando parties and four were fitted with torpedoes to deal with any enemy ships who tried to interfere. One ML was forced to turn back with engine trouble. The idea was the MLs would ‘wait’ around for two hours while the demolitions were carried out ashore, but someone forgot to ask the Germans to leave them alone and someone else didn’t really realise 18-20 knot ships were not ideal assault craft !!

             Within a very short space of time seven MLs were destroyed, followed by another and the MTB during the withdrawal. The MGB and three MLs were abandoned and sunk outside the estuary and the very gallant ‘306’ was captured by an enemy TBD after a 60min one sided fight. Only three MLs made it home and out of 611 Army and Navy personnel who took part, 169 were killed, 215 were captured with only 227 making it back to England. The vast majority of the 442 survivors were wounded, many more than once.

             A large number of decorations were awarded, 136 in all with five Victoria Crosses including two posthumous awards to Bill Savage on behalf of many other sailors, “unnamed in MLs, the MGB and the MTB, who gallantly carried out their duty in entirely exposed positions against enemy fire at very close range” and Tom Durrant, the only soldier VC to be awarded during a naval engagement.

             Keep your eyes and ears open for a forthcoming BBC documentary and hopefully, one day, a movie about  “The Greatest Raid of All”.

 

 



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Roger Pearson.
Bendigo, Victoria, Australia.

"Roger's Little Ships".
Modelling Allied Light Coastal Forces 1914-1945.


Posted By: K225
Date Posted: 01 December 2006 at 12:26am
I am surprised there hasn't been a proper movie made about this raid from a historic and action perspective there are few stories to beat it. Mind you I would be worried that they would overdo the CGIs and of course somehow it would have to be American PT boats leading the raid !!!

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She'd roll on wet grass!


Posted By: Roger P
Date Posted: 04 December 2006 at 11:03pm

Hello again,  

Watch this space re a movie. James Dorrian, author of "Storming St Nazaire" is working with Sheffield Television on their documentary to be released, hopefully to coincide with the raid's 65th anniversary, which of course is 28 March 2007. He is also working on a movie script, but I cannot say when (or if) this will come to fruition.

One can certainly hope!!



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Roger Pearson.
Bendigo, Victoria, Australia.

"Roger's Little Ships".
Modelling Allied Light Coastal Forces 1914-1945.


Posted By: johnk
Date Posted: 05 December 2006 at 11:56pm

Hello,

Don't normally post here, modelling not my thing personally but admire the work of those that do, re St Nazaire film, probabley got this totally wrong, but... thought there was a film involving certainly MLs attacking the lock gates on a dry dock during the war, ramming with exsplosive laden craft on a time delay, going up taking Germans with it? or as said, am thinking of the wrong raid?

 

John



Posted By: E.S.ChildsDrum1
Date Posted: 06 December 2006 at 12:30pm

             

                   Hi all.

   Yes there was afilm made of this raid and I remember seeing it but I cant remember the stars involved. I cant see how they could make this film now unless they use wartime footage  as none of those type of boats now exist.

          Regards Ted drum1



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E.S.Childs


Posted By: Christian
Date Posted: 06 December 2006 at 6:19pm

Hi Ted and John

There's a superb History Channel documentary about Op Chariot, with great footage of all the boats. Regarding a re-make of the movie, there's probably not that many people who'd know the difference between a Fairmile B and the Pride of Calais, but if the film makers really wanted to there are easily enough Bs around, many close to original and in working order (two or three in the UK, one in Belgium, three or four in Greece and a couple of others scattered around this side of the Atlantic and in this hemisphere, outside these parameters there's even more, around 30 in total globally) the Vosper MTB and Fairmile C MGB would be harder but I'm sure MTB 71 could be launched and although too short and flush decked she'd look the part (or perhaps MTB 98 Grayling or MTB 219, a houseboat in London, with a 70ft hull the same as 74) and houseboat Eidolen at Hayling Island is a sistership to the actual MGB used in the raid and she is apparently quite sound too. Now all we need is the destroyer, perhaps one of the many naval museums in the USA have one of the actual types on display....

Rgds,Christian. 



Posted By: johnk
Date Posted: 06 December 2006 at 6:42pm

Hello Christian and Ted,

 

Would love to see that documentary, must get this new fangled digital, well, would it not be great to get hold of some of these millions they put into these films, and get at least a couple of the craft mentioned going again ie like they did for MTB 102, who is of course still used for odd bits of filming now and then, moving to new berth at Newsons yard tomorrow I believe, best of luck with that, as you say, still a number of these craft about but going fast ie 162, and of course if we could really get some funds...a replica D? I know, , but still I can dream.

 

John 



Posted By: Christian
Date Posted: 06 December 2006 at 10:13pm
That's a dream I share, I'd like to see the bones of the Chatham D picked up and stored, that way when/if a project gets underway it will be classed as a rebuild (and not a replica) thus having more credibility if it can be shown that at least a portion of the boat is original. From Ted's photos it looks as though the bows may be re-usable, also all the sterngear if it's down there too. At worst the bows could be mounted on a plinth on the wall of any future premises of the bmpt or other similar organisation.Having said that, you really never know where or when these boats will turn up, d-zine has found what is almost certainly a Dark Class (believed extinct too)for sale in Florida! The Ds also travelled far and wide, a couple went to Argentina for example and half a dozen of the LRRCs were used as RAF houseboats in Fanara, I wonder if anyone knows what became of them? 


Posted By: Roger P
Date Posted: 06 December 2006 at 10:57pm

Hi Christian,

I would love to know more about the documentary you mentioned, such as, how long ago was it produced and how do I obtain a VHS or DVD copy?

The two movies I know of, and have, are 'Attack on the Iron Coast' with Lloyd Bridges which shows a Minesweeper and four fishing boats and the other, more accurate one is 'The Gift Horse' starring Trvor Howard and was made with help from the St Nazaire Society.



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Roger Pearson.
Bendigo, Victoria, Australia.

"Roger's Little Ships".
Modelling Allied Light Coastal Forces 1914-1945.


Posted By: johnk
Date Posted: 07 December 2006 at 8:25am

Hello All,

Just posted re MGB 81, most interesting, now there is a good candidate for a film role, not heard much about her of late or HSL 102, would be nice if the origional idea of a "Battle of Britain Flight" of the sea had come to pass, what a great thing that would be for coastal craft and the personnel.

John 



Posted By: Christian
Date Posted: 07 December 2006 at 9:24am

Hi John and Roger

The documentary is part of the "History's Raiders" series, I did look into buying a copy but I found that it is available only in the USA (something to do with film rights etc) the vendors (I cannot remember who, I found them using Google) said they could post to a friend or relative in the USA for them to forward to me. I never got round to it though.

Rgds,Christian. 



Posted By: johnk
Date Posted: 07 December 2006 at 3:26pm

Hi Christian,

 

Indeed, the news re the Dark is very interesting, no doubt going for quite a sum and heavily modified now. Re the D, well, there's an idea, very stormy and windy here today, not sure what's left now, could easily try and have a look, not far from me, have contact with local marine contractor, may by they were the ones commissioned to break her, don't know, but...1 would need some cash 2 somewhere to put the bits, but latter not impossible, the former....intriguing, better some bits than none, stern of 142? on home page of BMPT. Your ideas re ones abroad, possible I guess, though I usally refer to Phil Simmons work saying the last was a Shoreham, broken a few years ago now, though wether for obvious reasons of time and resources, that only applied to the UK. Will try and pay that visit and revert in due course,

John 



Posted By: northeastuser
Date Posted: 07 December 2006 at 6:49pm
Has anyone a map refrence for the old site of raf fanara? Iv been looking in goolge earth but the suez cannal is a big place.If you look at hartlepool in goolge earth you can easily make out the hdml that is here So spoting a 'D' would be easy.(asuming its in an area covered)


Posted By: Roger P
Date Posted: 23 December 2006 at 1:51am

Greetings again from OZ,

Found the History channel documentary titled "Greatest Raids: Target St Nazaire" available in the US and Canada only for $US24.95. It can be purchased through:

http://store.aetv.com/html/search/searchindex.jhtml?search=target+st - http://store.aetv.com/html/search/searchindex.jhtml?search=t arget+st

After Christmas I will purchase a copy via a mate in the states and if necessary have it converted to play on my DVD player, although I may be lucky enough and not have to.

I'll be happy to report the outcome.

Merry Christmas,



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Roger Pearson.
Bendigo, Victoria, Australia.

"Roger's Little Ships".
Modelling Allied Light Coastal Forces 1914-1945.


Posted By: E.S.ChildsDrum1
Date Posted: 24 December 2006 at 3:45pm

 

           Greetings to all, have a good christmas and keep boating.

                     Regards Ted Childs Drum1



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E.S.Childs


Posted By: clive
Date Posted: 31 December 2006 at 3:48pm

Hi,

 I found this account of S Nazaire, it is pretty much the same as the other one but with pictures!

 I saw a program about WWII commandos and they were intervieving people that took part in the raid, I think one of them stole a motorbike and escaped unless i am getting mixed up with film! Nevertheless the documentary was excellent and the 'boys' (old men) had a good laugh about the password!

I hope this works.   http://www.combinedops.com/St%20Nazaire.htm - http://www.combinedops.com/St%20Nazaire.htm

 



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masbie something in the water.   www.freewebs.com/masb32/


Posted By: Roger P
Date Posted: 27 February 2007 at 11:24pm

Greetings from OZ,

I have had my copy of the above mentioned DVD for some weeks now, my apologies for not sending this sooner. The DVD plays just fine here in Australia. I do not know why it is only available for purchase in the US/Canada.

The title on the cover actually states "Greatest Raids Target Saint Nazarene", but I can tell you it is in fact all about St Nazaire and to my mind not too bad a documentary and well worth the $US 24.95 plus postage. My suggestion, if you wish to see something about the raid would be to ask a friend in the US or Canada to buy it for you.



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Roger Pearson.
Bendigo, Victoria, Australia.

"Roger's Little Ships".
Modelling Allied Light Coastal Forces 1914-1945.


Posted By: clive
Date Posted: 18 March 2007 at 8:29pm

there is a documentary on bbc 2 about this raid now, Idid not know and 1/2 hour missed !!

 



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masbie something in the water.   www.freewebs.com/masb32/


Posted By: johnk
Date Posted: 18 March 2007 at 9:58pm

Hi Clive,

 

What a pity, just caught it 99 per cent myself, my Father came to me and said it was on talking about the Tirpitz! what a good programme, despite J Clarkson not being to every ones taste!, shots of the Western Lady at Torquay, lauch of a B, and of construction, fantastic, and what they can do with graphics now. Contacted Steve, what a great thing she could commerate perhaps, with the large saloon as I mentioned to him, a good space to show and explain this chapter in history, I think we need to show this sort of thing, not in a gung ho way, yes, there was incredible acts of bravery but a great sacrifice as well.

John  



Posted By: Danny
Date Posted: 19 March 2007 at 4:17pm

Hello,

This  TV  program  is  repeated  on  Saturday  24th  March  on  BBC 2  at  20.25  if  you  missed  it.  

Regards

Danny




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