Just seen that Sungo is on the National Register of Historic Ships, as a registered vessel, the lowest catergoray under designated and then core ship, nice pics,

JohnK

Hi Tramontana,

Indeed, I to am interested to know if our Canadian friends have made any progress with her, I read they were applying for government  recognised status which would lead to possible funding from the Canadian Government, I know this all takes a long time, witness the struggle we had with the Medway Queen! but I do hope they are making progress as it would be great for her to find a home in Canada as the last of the 29th flotilla. Just seen in Ships Monthly the modern Canadian Navy has been given more funds for upgrades to the fleet.

JohnK

Indeed, but of course a tragic incident involving one of the subs, one chap died, but what a pity we no longer run/build diesel electric subs, they are very advanced now, indeed the Germans build some of the most advanced.

Johnk

Hello Chaps,

Since this topic is about MTB 486, I thought I should speak for the CCFT.  With the (invaluable) assistance of Philip Simons and John Lambert (Anatomy of the Ship – D Type Fairmile MTB), we have positively identified Sungo as 486, which was the command of the SO of the 29^th (Canadian) MTB Flotilla, LtCdr C. Anthony Law.  She replaced his first boat 459 which was almost sunk by an 88 mm shore battery.  His 2ic was Lt “Bones” Charles Burk, but sadly, Burk’s previous command, MTB 439 (a mark V BPB Co 71.5 footer) is the soil-filled hulk “The Clive” in Shoreham, and well past any possibility of restoration. 

The level of interest that we have generated in our attempts to save MTB 486 in Canada is negligible - even within the naval community.  This does not mean we will ever give up.  We simply cannot do that.  But it does make our task that much harder.  We at the CCFT have nothing but admiration for the crew of the Old Warboat Company for their attempts to save MTB 506, 486’s sister, and we wish them all the best in their next project.  Kudos also to the BMPT for all their very hard work in this field.

Incidentally, Canada was actually offered the Upholders for free in exchange for allowing the British Army to train in the North West Territories for a number of years, but we cleverly turned the UK government down, waited for the subs to rot, and then bought them for £224 million because the next cheapest lot were in the billions.  We were still operating the Oberons while five were museum boats in the UK, Australia and Brazil!

We have our own way of doing things in Canada.

Cheers.

Nicholas

Lt(N) Nicholas CM Armstrong, CF

Hi  Nicholas,

Well, did not know the stuff re the purchase of the subs, I heard they went for a knock down price, the Oberon's were of course built at Chatham Dockyard, closed in 1984, part of which I work in at the marina, we have HMS Ocelot the last vessel built at Chatham for the RN, but then the next three vessels went to Canada, can't remember the name of the last one. I thought the British Army did go to Canada for training, but I guess the proposal was for a more permanent/regular base.

Johnk

Hello John,

Ironically, Onyx, which was at Birkenhead, was to have been HMCS Ojibwa.  The Canadian government was so keen to have an Oberon fast back then, that we took the then just completed Onyx, and let the RN have Ojibwa, and the names were switched.  As far as I know, the only Canadian specification was that the hatches were to be larger, so Onyx must have been unique in that repect.  There's a group truying to save Onondaga, so perhaps, she will be the sixth Oberon to become a museum boat - depending on what has happened to Onyx, of course.

Cheers,

Nicholas, 

Lt(N) Nicholas CM Armstrong, CF

Hello Chaps,

I was chatting with of my fellow officers who also happens to be a marine surveyor, and she indicated to me that taking a wooden boat that has spend her life in salt or brackish water into fresh water is a death sentence - the rots sets in fast.  Has anybody heard of this happening as well?  If so, it would change our plans dramatically as we could not bring 486 to Toronto, on Lake Ontario.  Fortunately, my family are moving to Halifax, Nova Scotia in a few years, so that would make a good hoem port for her, if she can be made operational.  Hopefully, we can find local volunteers to help out in the new location then.

Also, we would like to get a marine survey done of MTB 486's hull and we wondering if anybody could recommend someone.  It would have to be superficial, as she cannot be hauled up on a slip until we actually buy her, but we need some indication of how sound (or rotten - God forbid) her hull is, and we would of course need insurance if she were to be shifted from her present berth.

Many thanks for any assistance that can be provided.

Cheers,

Nicholas, 

Lt(N) Nicholas CM Armstrong, CF

Hi Nicholas,

 As you say, fresh water is not ideal for a mahogany boat, although after spending time in salt water some say they the salt is in the wood and delays the onset of rot, MGB 56 which was in fresh water for 45 years before she was let go down was reputed to be in good shape but the river had silted up beneath her so as  Ron said (on a different thread) that may have helped.

 If you could get 486 to Canada I doubt a relaunch would be your first priority, so this would give you time to consider your options. I have MASB 32 and she is moored in fresh water, she needs a lot of work on her hull bottom, when this is done the plan is to sheath her (the bottom at least), there is no point sheathing unless the hull is sound so some may say 'why bother' but the additional strength, piece of mind and lower ongiong costs outweigh the negatives (if any) then you can play carefree in any water!

Best of luck to you. Clive.