British Power Boats 71.5ft MGB/MTB’s
Printed From: BMPT Forum
Category: Boats (In alphabetical order)
Forum Name: Motor Gun Boats
Forum Description: Discussion on Motor Gun Boats
URL: http://www.bmpt.co.uk/forum_posts.asp?TID=83
Printed Date: 26 March 2026 at 6:39pm
Topic: British Power Boats 71.5ft MGB/MTB’s
Posted By: Christian
Subject: British Power Boats 71.5ft MGB/MTB’s
Date Posted: 23 September 2005 at 5:36pm
| Have just been contacted by Capt. Morgan Cruises in Malta re. sale of two 71'6" harbour ferries ex-British Power Boats MGB's(later MTB's)called Raia and Ambra.They will be available at the end of this year,I can't have one as I don't have a place to keep her but surely there's good homes for them out there? |
Replies:
Posted By: AndyS
Date Posted: 10 July 2006 at 11:43am
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Christian I think that one of them was the well know 'Southerner' which had fantastic performanace, but does not quite look the same now! Regards AndyS |
Posted By: Christian
Date Posted: 10 July 2006 at 12:38pm
| That's right,she was owned by Southern television. |
Posted By: Paul Theakston
Date Posted: 19 July 2006 at 8:17pm
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Do we know if the two boats in Malta have been sold? Anyone know what condition they were in, or which boats they were? PaulT
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Posted By: Christian
Date Posted: 19 July 2006 at 10:32pm
| Hi Paul,they were available last week,they are superb,they are only ten grand apiece.See Where Are Those Boats Now,Boats At Gibraltar and Malta for pics and more info. |
Posted By: Paul Theakston
Date Posted: 20 July 2006 at 10:38pm
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Hi Christian Thanks for the fast reply. Silly me, I found the pictures and boat numbers justt after I posted the message, but it is interesting that they are still for sale, and not at silly money at that. I assume they haven't still got original engines in. Cheers
Paul
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Posted By: Christian
Date Posted: 21 July 2006 at 7:57am
| Hi Paul,I think they've got small diesels for harbour fery service,but I do not know for certain-would you contact Kevin at Captain Morgan cruises and ask him for this info and anything else which may help prospective buyers?I think he'll be cheered up by lots of different people asking questions as he is concerned for their future and this will indicate the level of interest.Thanks,Christian. |
Posted By: Paul Theakston
Date Posted: 25 September 2006 at 6:15pm
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Hi Christian I have been corresponding with Kevin at Capt Morgan re the identity if the two boats he has there. I believe that the MTB number he has been told for Raia is not consistent with a short boat. He says it might refer to a previous boat which was lost in their possesssion. Their identity therefore remains a mystery to me. Do you know enough about the detail of these boats generally to be able to say that somewhere on the boats there will be a clue to their original identity? Maybe a makers plate, or boat number stamped on frames or the like? I guess close inspection and measurement will help narrow it down. I am building up to a visit to look at them, but the more certainty I have of their origin, the more enthusiastic I will be! Can you give me any help? Cheers Paul T
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Posted By: Christian
Date Posted: 25 September 2006 at 9:19pm
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Hi Paul Ambra's ID came to me from Philip Simons, the authority on the subject so likely to be correct. I think you may be thinking about MGB pennant numbers instead of MTB numbers, the Camper and Nicholson long MGB/MTBs had numbers in the MGB series.As far as I know there are no C&N MGB/MTB survivors left, Gay Viking having sunk in the Bahamas in the late 60s or early 70s whilst in ferry service.Gay Viking was MGB506 whereas Ambra was MTB506 (later 1506 Proud Grenadier). To my knowledge Raia's ID has not been confirmed.Experts have been out to see her already, but if you look for the 4-digit build number and find it you will become a hero! It should be either on a deckhead beam, the forward surface of the samson post 'tweendecks,or stamped onto the floorboards if any originals remain. Gay Viking in the Bahamas. Regards,Christian. |
Posted By: AndyS
Date Posted: 26 September 2006 at 2:43pm
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For BPBCo boats another place to look is at the top of the laminated stem (inside) and possibly the transom gunwhale. Kingposts are relatively lite and changeable items on the BPBCo boats so unlikely to be original. Happy hunting. AndyS |
Posted By: Paul Theakston
Date Posted: 30 September 2006 at 9:20am
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Thanks AndyS for the additional clues. Christian, I had heard of Philip Simons expertise on the subject, and may well pester him directly on the subject. You will also be right on my confusion between pennant numbers and boat numbers. If Ambra was MTB 506, which was certainly a BPBCo build, does anyone have record of her activities in the Mediterranean? I can find nothing that records her being part of any of the wartime Flotilla's in the Medi. In hope
Paul T |
Posted By: clive
Date Posted: 12 December 2006 at 12:54pm
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Hello all, I have the remains of what I think is MGB56 sunk and rotting without a superstructure in a mooring in Norwich. I'll try and take some photos to post soon for those who are interested. The MGB was called Morning Flight, she was used as a houseboat by the late Commander Ron Ashby for more than 41 years in Thorpe. Morning Flight was sold by us a couple of times and the superstructure removed to enable her to pass under a low bridge and onto the river but the relevant authorities would no allow her on the main river in case she sank. Since then (early 90s) the hull has been wrapped in polythene to allow her to be floated in another rescue attempt but abandoned. I recon she is too wet even for firewood but would be an addition for the gallery! ------------- masbie something in the water. www.freewebs.com/masb32/ |
Posted By: Christian
Date Posted: 12 December 2006 at 3:27pm
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Hi Clive Thanks for the info, look forward to seeing the pictures. Her close sister (70ft BPB Whaleback) MGB 55 survived at Portchester until 1985, the CFVA had tried to preserve her but she was beyond repair. Rgds,Christian. |
Posted By: jimmy p
Date Posted: 19 December 2006 at 5:35am
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Hi Clive, If you want her off your hands pm me an address to look at her as i'm after a whaleback. Seriously thinking of buying a vosper in malta that christian has tipped me off to (ambra or raia) but doing that as a liveaboard would leave me with enough money for a basket case as well compared to house prices at mo. Do you know the yard number? Narrow her identity down definitively!
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Posted By: Pioneer
Date Posted: 19 December 2006 at 8:55am
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Hello 'jimmy p' Just a small point -'Ambra' and 'Raia' are not Vosper's but BPB's ------------- Pioneer - Forum Moderator |
Posted By: dgray
Date Posted: 19 December 2006 at 5:23pm
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Hi Jimmy, Tried to send you a message but your mailbox is still full. Did you get to see HSL145 or lookup Mr Crump as you'd hoped to do in November? Do let us know what's happening..... Cheers ------------- Don Only a number, not even a name. How shall posterity hear of thy fame? |
Posted By: clive
Date Posted: 19 December 2006 at 8:14pm
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Well, here are some photos of the somewhat abandoned MGB56 as of today. I had a row around her, the hull planking seems quite hard apart from where she has had repairs! there are holes in the deck and most of the bearers have gone She is in my ownership but has been sunk for most that 15 years or so. she was wrapped in polythene, floated and some of the superstructure removed to allow her to pass under some low bridges onto the river but not allowed passage. we then gave the man his £100 back and left the boat where it was(and is) She is free to a good (or bad) home or available for a team building salvage attempt weekend! ..seriously though, the polythene is quite thick and passes right underneath her to deck level from bow to stern so would float with some decent pumps which I have. Please dont visit the site if you know where she is as a friend of mine looks after the site. contact me first and I sort it out no problem. Thanks Clive... ------------- masbie something in the water. www.freewebs.com/masb32/ |
Posted By: jimmy p
Date Posted: 20 December 2006 at 2:20am
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Thanks Pioneer, i stand corrected. Actually emptied my inbox now, oops. Been snowed under with work but usually quiet until end of jan so have to do a roadtrip to see mr crump & clives boat. Get plenty of pics for site while there.
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Posted By: northeastuser
Date Posted: 11 February 2007 at 11:00pm
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Hi, I keep meaning to post this but never seem to get round to it. MGB56 is one of the Canadian whalebacks built for the Norwegian 11th flotilla and I believe she was in service with a mtb 102. My scribbled notes say she was a 74ft 1939 class. My notes were a result of a telephone conversation with a gentleman from the costal forces trust. He was reading to me over the phone an extract from Home Waters At War by L.C.Renalds? I was reminded of this info while reading about the Canadian whalebacks built by the BMP co in Canada. (Source john Prichard.) Perhaps someone with a little more info that me could check this out. Perhaps the Canadians may be interested in her.She may be rarer than your normal whaleback and to rare to be a houseboat. |
Posted By: jimmy p
Date Posted: 12 February 2007 at 1:46am
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NE, Thought it might be. dont know if any 70ft type 2's where built at hythe. But... Checked with the royal navy museum & they say she's from Hythe, launched 5th sept 1940, 70ft,16.5ftx 4ft draught. 3x Merlins not Napiers. 28tons. Bit of a mystery there! Are their any other 70ft whalebacks left?? With the small number of 63footers this one must be extremely rare, maybe last of its kind!! Definatley worth preserving if she cant be restored just yet. If Cmdr Ashby can give her a new life after seeing action on them we owe it to him as well as the boat. If its beyond our pockets has anyone got the beckhams phone number? ------------- A boat is a hole in the water surrounded by wood, into which one throws money |
Worth asking the ships plans collection at the NMM in greenwich.
Posted By: alross2
Date Posted: 12 February 2007 at 3:12am
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A bit of confusion here, gentlemen. MGB 56 was a one of the 70' boats originally built for the French Navy as VTB23-40 and taken over by the RN as MGB 50-67. The Canadian manned boats were 71'6" MTBs, also built by BPB, while the Canadian-built MTB 332-343 were 70' types. The latter were very similar to the 70' MGBs in appearance. Al Ross
------------- Al Ross II |
Posted By: jimmy p
Date Posted: 12 February 2007 at 8:12am
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Cheers Al! Anyone know her war record? ------------- A boat is a hole in the water surrounded by wood, into which one throws money |
Posted By: northeastuser
Date Posted: 12 February 2007 at 8:21am
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Ahh well I have to confess I cant read my own scribbles’ at times. that’s one of the reasons iv held off posting. Can anyone post the relevant section of that book so I can see what the hell iv tried to write down? Cheers.Her war record is in that book. |
Posted By: AndyS
Date Posted: 12 February 2007 at 9:11am
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Just add a bit to Al's notes, which are spot on. The 70' design was origninally intended to have Power-RRMerlin engines, but the later 70' boats were built with Packards. These boats were a significant advance in lightweight timber construction structural details for production. they were also formally designed from the strength aspect and extensively tested hydrodynamically and so are very significant in the evoltion of these types of boats. Best regards AndyS |
Posted By: dgray
Date Posted: 27 February 2007 at 12:27am
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I have a book that says the 70' class were loa 70' beam 20' and mean draft 4'. All below were built at Hythe MGB's 6-21 Two Napier petrol engines (23 knots) 31 Tons MGB 46 3 x Rolls Royce Merlins (42.5max/39 continuous) - 32 Tons MGB 50-67 3 x Isotta Fraschini (40 max/38 continuous) - 34 Tons Presumably with no supply of Italian engines, Packards were filled. |
Posted By: jimmy p
Date Posted: 27 February 2007 at 1:39am
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Heard from NMM. They have plans for 70ft mgb conversion & ma/sb but on tracing paper & rather fragile. Possibly MGB56 plans from Hythe when they've sorted through thier boxes of stuff. Cant photocopy due to condition but a good look over plans should clear up any confusion. Take a drawing & add details from yard plans? Possibly plans for MTB506 there but they cant promise until they've had a really good mooch through their archive. When 506 sorted, 56 looked at, 145 ect i'll try & have a day down there nosing around with their curator ------------- A boat is a hole in the water surrounded by wood, into which one throws money |