Thornycroft 2422 MTB

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   Hi All,
Wow! I seemed to have unearthed a mass of further info.
To confirm a few points.
The Thornycroft drawing No 23103 clearly shows detail of the Bofors mountings. This is for boat type 2422.
Thornycroft drawing 22900 is the detail hull dimesions for boats 2422, 2430, 2431, 2471, and 2463/4 It is 71' 9" O/A length. Beam 16'.
Thornycroft drawing No 23303 is clearly marked as for the Irish Govt. and allocated the ID 'M1'. It also states 'As fitted' with the Bofors gun and four Thornycroft RY/12 engines paired to two props. This is dated 25-5-1940. It has four single depth charge racks, port stbd and two on stern. No M/C gun positions, and twin 18" tubes. Further minor differences such as search light location, addition of 10ft life raft, and hydrophone gear on port frd.
None of the drawings make any reference to the Italian engines.
But there are many other drawings in the NMM archives that I did not persue since Boat type 2422 is of particular interest at present.
Regards to all,
Martin ej

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martin ej Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Newbie Joined: 20 October 2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 10	Post Options Post Reply Quote martin ej Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 24 October 2007 at 12:04pm
	Hi All, Wow! I seemed to have unearthed a mass of further info. To confirm a few points. The Thornycroft drawing No 23103 clearly shows detail of the Bofors mountings. This is for boat type 2422. Thornycroft drawing 22900 is the detail hull dimesions for boats 2422, 2430, 2431, 2471, and 2463/4 It is 71' 9" O/A length. Beam 16'. Thornycroft drawing No 23303 is clearly marked as for the Irish Govt. and allocated the ID 'M1'. It also states 'As fitted' with the Bofors gun and four Thornycroft RY/12 engines paired to two props. This is dated 25-5-1940. It has four single depth charge racks, port stbd and two on stern. No M/C gun positions, and twin 18" tubes. Further minor differences such as search light location, addition of 10ft life raft, and hydrophone gear on port frd. None of the drawings make any reference to the Italian engines. But there are many other drawings in the NMM archives that I did not persue since Boat type 2422 is of particular interest at present. Regards to all, Martin ej
	Martin

tramontana Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Senior Member Joined: 06 April 2007 Status: Offline Points: 418	Post Options Post Reply Quote tramontana Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 25 October 2007 at 3:23pm
	Going back to my reference books after my last entry on the Forum there were three boats built 24,25, & 28 the last boat was a War loss in 1941 the full dimensions were 72x161/2x33/4 feet are given, however it does say six similiar boats were built for the Irish M1-6, the emphises being on similiar and not exactly the same which could account for the drawing variation, I was on a civilian ship which had been designed and built with the gun rings fitted and a strenghened deckheads but the guns were never fitted, it was all "just in case" or depending on availability which I would suggest would be the reason on the Thornycroft boats unless the Irish had Bofor's in their stores, which reminds me that one of the R.N,s post war offshore patrol vessels had a Bofors gun fitted which started it's life off on a gun carriage in the Western Desert in W.W.2!! I did begin to wonder as to whether the M boats were the boats Pioneer mentioned as all the names begin with "M" but there were 8 boats in that Class and not 6. Regards.

Magic Fingers Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Senior Member Joined: 19 March 2007 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 113	Post Options Post Reply Quote Magic Fingers Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 25 October 2007 at 8:23pm
	MTB28 war loss caught fire while being refuelled and rearmed at HMS Hornet. The crew of MTB102 got a line to her and towed her off the jetty out into Haslar Creek when she blew up. 28 and 102 disappeared in a cloud of mud, water and boat. When it cleared 102 was still out in the creek unharmed. Strengthened deck heads on Merchant ships. I was always told that the shipping companies got a government grant if these were fitted "just in case". One of my ships, built 1948, certainly had them. Richard.
	If it ain't broke don't fix it!

Magic Fingers Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Senior Member Joined: 19 March 2007 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 113	Post Options Post Reply Quote Magic Fingers Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 25 October 2007 at 8:36pm
	2422, is that the Thornycroft yard number? MTB102 was Yard number 1763 which has no relevance to her RN Pennant number. Richard.
	If it ain't broke don't fix it!

tramontana Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Senior Member Joined: 06 April 2007 Status: Offline Points: 418	Post Options Post Reply Quote tramontana Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 25 October 2007 at 8:44pm
	Spot on Richard, that's how the shipping companies got their subsidies just in case they (the ships) were S.T.U.F.T. ; I have a small picture of 102 on trials have you got a copy of it?

Magic Fingers Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Senior Member Joined: 19 March 2007 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 113	Post Options Post Reply Quote Magic Fingers Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 25 October 2007 at 8:52pm
	Thanks Ron. Possibly.We have several with the trials flag up. I would need to see to confirm. Richard.
	If it ain't broke don't fix it!

tramontana Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Senior Member Joined: 06 April 2007 Status: Offline Points: 418	Post Options Post Reply Quote tramontana Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 25 October 2007 at 9:08pm
	Richard sounds like the same picture by Vosper

martin ej Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Newbie Joined: 20 October 2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 10	Post Options Post Reply Quote martin ej Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 25 October 2007 at 9:38pm
	Hi Tramontana, Re the fitting of Bofors 40mm. on Thornycroft boats. Having been in touch with Bofors BAE SYSTEMS Sweeden they have no record as to this application. They may have had but junked their records! Anyway, from suposition I figure that this application was not practical since laying onto a target was a two man operation, one working traverse, one elevation. That on a rolling MTB would have been near impossible. Probably explains why this boat did not enter acive service. As for the Irish? Who knows, it's possible. However the drawings for the Irish boats suggest a primary intention for sub hunting being fitted with sonar gear according to the drawings. regards, martin ej
	Martin

martin ej Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Newbie Joined: 20 October 2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 10	Post Options Post Reply Quote martin ej Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 25 October 2007 at 9:49pm
	Hi Richard, 2422 is the boat type number. Basic hull, internal layout and deck superstructure. I don't think it is a yard number since it covers several boats. Nor is it a service number. Any material changes other than armaments would perhaps have resulted in a different boat type number eg engines since the (faint) pencil note regards Packard engines seems only to be a drawing office comment. Using the 2422 as the start point for another design perhaps? Regards martin ej
	Martin

tramontana Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Senior Member Joined: 06 April 2007 Status: Offline Points: 418	Post Options Post Reply Quote tramontana Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 26 October 2007 at 11:54am
	don't forget the loader martinej, I will have to re-read flag 4 I am sure it mentions a boat (not a Thorny) having one fitted so that they could shoot up loco's with at night in the Med area and Bofor's have been fitted to Fast attack craft post war so it must be practicable.